I HATE my computer. Okay, so I'm going to vent here. So, I read most of the first article, do lot's of copy-pasting and responding, and then open the next one. It freezes on me, and I have to shut down the window. Well guess what? It also shut down THIS window, so I lost EVERYTHING. Grr...

Well, since I'm not going through and reading that infuriating, idiotic aritcle again, this is the general gist of what I was saying:

This guy is an idiot. Look, he's taking scientific studies and denouncing them as fraud with no eveidence to prove that they are wrong. NONE. Just him, sitting here, being all smug about his superior intellect, quoting ONE person's book/article, and saying that just because she is pro-virus she is wrong. This is idiocy. He has no proof whatsoever on anything he says. He gives links to studies that prove him wrong, hoping that eevrybody thinks like he does, with a conspiracy theorist mind. He says in there, and this just got me p!ssed, that the scientists and doctors are trying to convince you what is good for your child while simultaniously trying to do what's bad for them. It's moronic. Especially since the info he gives supports vaccination. All the things about pregnant women NOT getting vaccinated, he's talking about the actual, living, working, virus. NOT the vaccine that can not cause sickness unless you are allergic to it. He's just sitting around, reading things, and giving his opinion on them and displaying it as fact to the general public. He is NOT a doctor, I doubt he knows very much about medicine, and he's trying to convince people that REAL doctors are just out to get them. It's stupid. This is NOT a medical article, and so it is NOT reliable at all. It is ONE person, who is NOT getting second opinions, telling you how to raise your children and telling you to ignore the doctors who know what they are talking about.

And now, looking at the main site, the whole website is just conspiracy theorists talking about things with no evidence, just like this guy is. Not a reliable source for medical information, wouldn't you say?

I am not attacking you, I swear. I'm just mad at the moron who write these articles for misinforming the general public.

I'm pro-vaccination.

I have had every vaccination thats been offered to me at school (tetnus, polio, three meningacoccal, and three cervical cancer)plus all the ones you get as a baby and the most that has happened to me is a swollen arm after tetnus.
There are risks with everything that you do, but I seriously believe that with vaccinations, the pro's totally outweigh the con's.
I could step onto the street today and get hit by a car, or walk under a tree and a branch fall on my head.
I'm not going to risk something like cervical cancer due to the fact that there's a tiny chance I might react to the vaccine.

Okay, so I come to this site to talk about names, and tell myself I'm not going to comment on other things. But I feel so strongly about the vaccination thing I couldn't help it! So I think I'll mention a few more things and hopefully be done with it. That first article was sort of strangely written. The second article is more straight to the point and informative. I hope you'll read that second article.

To address the last post real quick, yeah, this may seem backwards to some of you how I see it. Of course, anything can happen to any of us at any minute. Sure, a tree could fall on me or I could get hit by a car. But those really are just accidents. Well, I would rather accidentally get a disease than put up with a serious complication from the vaccinations. We all die at some point. We all know that. Yes, the vaccines have caused many, many problems for a lot of people (of course, mostly talking about the children). If my child was autistic and I knew it came from the vaccination (many parents of autistic children will tell you, yes, they know it), it would be so hard to live with that thought. We live so much cleaner these days, have so much more and varied food and vitamins and minerals, and have so much better water. That is the main reason we all don't have so many of those diseases the vaccines are for. Also, look at the Amish. They have like no autism cases. They have so many less health and behavior problems as a whole. If the community has a bit of whooping cough or whatever hit a few people, they generally don't die from it.

One thing about even seasonal flu that the second article discusses is that the vaccine isn't even able to address the current mutated strain that is out there.

The problem with the vaccine schedule, too, is that it's too much too fast for those little bodies. An infant and toddler doesn't need to handle all those viruses and adjuvants.

And about trusting your doctor fully. Yes, there are individuals who are great. But you should trust no one fully. Just because he or she says something, that doesn't make it gospel. Even for me, of course. Just because anyone says something doesn't mean you should believe it, even if they have several degrees, work for the government, or whatever. Doctors get paid. I would like to think that every doctor has every patient's best interest at heart. But they are also running a business. But I don't want to slam doctors, doctors are much needed and overall wonderful people, I'm sure. But do consider the billions of dollars these companies make that make the vaccines. They have a lot of incentive to push public policy, recruit doctors to use their products, etc. My husband and I have actually had doctors admit that the reason the vaccine schedule is the way it is is because there is a captive audience. These tiny children, of course, do not have the choice, and all these parents just trust what the good doctor says. They do these vaccines so much so fast because they're getting paid very well. And the government backs it all up. Did you know the vaccine companies have immunity against possible lawsuits over this new, not "tried and true" (if you want to call any of the vaccines that) H1N1 vaccine? The gov't is already protecting them from any trouble.

There's probably a lot more I'm missing or could comment on, but it is way past my bedtime. I mean no harm or ill will to anyone, I promise. In fact, the opposite. Best wishes to all!

And every last bit of that makes absolute sense. I personally will not buy into the autism thing, I don't see the connection AT ALL besides it gives people something to blame. I'm sorry if you believe that vaccination causes autism, but I'm not going to buy that until I see evidence from a medical source with more than one person. I seriously hate that article, it's just so badly written and seems so self-centered, I just can't tkae it seriously at all. I would be extremely to read an article from another, more medically/scientifically approved source that wasn't written by this guy, who as it appears to me writes a ton of 'medical' articles. When I didn't read a single thing about how he was qualified in any of this.

As for the doctors, yes they are running a buisness. Yes they do want to make money. But I will not believe that they would cause something like autism just for another thousand bucks. They became doctors for a reason, and I'm sure that the majority of them, if vaccines did have a direct link to autism, would bring it up and tell people not to get vaccinated, and they would find another way. There are some bad ones, but there are more good ones. And if I'm wrong about that, than it is a sad world we live in.

As for small children handling the vaccine, the vaccine is just a dead form of a virus. I'd rather handle the virus that can't hurt me than the actual disease.

As for the second article discussing a vaccine for a disease we won't even deal with, things like that happen. People go over to Asia/Africa, where the flu's start, and try to figure out the three that the world will be dealing with. Sometimes they're wrong, and you get vaccinated for a strain that doesn't even come to your continent. Then you get the flu.

I have no problems with anybody not wanting to get vaccinated, for any reason. So, I think it would be best if we can both (all) just agree to disagree, seeing as both of us aren't going to budge an inch. This IS a fun debate though...

Yeah, as I said before, this isn't the place for this. And, you're right, I won't budge. Just look at when autism started to rise and correlate that with when they at least doubled the vaccine schedule. My kids are supposed to get more than twice the amounts than I was in the mid 70's. It's ridiculous. And they will not just come out and say any time soon that there's a link. It's too dangerous and risky for them. Maybe in 80 years or something. I'll tell you this, I'm a dental hygienist. Pretty much everybody knows silver fillings are not healthy for you. But dentists have scripts to ease the public's concerns. Basically, if you question the mercury fillings in your mouth, they all say, "Well, yeah, we pretty much don't do those anymore, but that doesn't mean there's anything wrong with them." Excuse me, but that's just not the whole truth. They don't want everyone running around screaming that they were evil for using that material. Yes, dentistry is more advanced now and dentistry made mistakes before out of simple ignorance. As a society, we continue to learn that practices understood as safe and acceptable years ago, in actuality were not. The same for medicine and doctors. What gets me is I still see some dentists placing those amalgam fillings. A lot of dentists and doctors (and any other profession) have the mindset often that, "Well, that's what I learned in school, so it must be okay or right." Well, no! It may have been all we had then, but it's time to progress and move on to something better! Did you know that Russia and other European countries REFUSE to use US made vaccines because we CONTINUE to use thimerisol (mercury) as a preservative in our vaccines to save the vaccine makers money? There is a link, to all these issues (not just autism, but diabetes, allergies, asthma, alzheimers, etc, etc,etc) but our government, our system, our professionals, our leadership are too prideful and money hungry to admit it. Not to say there is not good in the world, there is, and I strive for that. But, yes, the world has a lot of bad, too. You know a little money and a little power corrupt. Lord of the Rings, anyone? Celianne, I am generally very naive and trusting. But I am now twice your age (yikes!) and, yes, being in my 30's and being a mom, I see things differently now. (SOOOOOO weird how that happens!) I don't want to scare anyone, but I really do believe this stuff. Consider if a conspiracy theory, as you mentioned, is actually true. Whether you like something or not, if it's true, it's true. Plain and simple. Can you change your mind about something even though it's not ideal? Yes, I hate some of the things I have to consider about raising my children. But I can't just act like it doesn't exist. That won't help them, me, or anyone. I was hoping by posting this and taking my time on some of this, I could possibly save little Mia, Sienna, and all these other precious babes we're on here for some problems. If this gets even one of you thinking and researching from both angles, not just what "they" put out there, I am glad. Anyway, maybe if any of you have any other questions, you could pm me. Peace to all and just beware and look out for you and yours!

The reason there is no autism in the Amish community is because they don't label behaviors. They whip your butt if you don't conform. Also, they intermarry and all have common ancestry and genetics which may have something to do with their medical situation.

The reason there has been such an extreme increase in Autism cases is there is an extreme increase in the range of what can be called Autism. My older sister fits the diagnosis for Aspergers, but luckily she was born and well on to adulthood before some docter slapped that label on her.

I mean, one form of Autism is called "Pervasive Developmental Disorder - Not Otherwise Specified" That is doctor speak for "I don't know what is wrong, let's call it Autism".

And parents, looking for a reason or a cause, blame vaccines, something that all children have in common. Hmmm, what about diaper rash cream, new T shirts, toys from china, dust mites, polution, or any of the other things that millions of kids get exposed to. There are plenty of unvaccinted kids who get autism (though the "novacciners" would like you to ignore that). They are usually the younger sibling of a child diagnosed with autism, who's parents thought they were protecting their new baby from the condition by not vaccinating, and now mom and dad are scratching their heads trying to figure out why little Johnny is acting just like little Jimmy did.